Taco Tabs vs Marlin/TC gussets (4th Gen T4R)

[Drift Monkey]

https://www.polyperformance.com/pol...5-tacoma-03-09-4runner-gx470-07-09-fj-cruiser

https://www.marlincrawler.com/axles/front-axle-armor/hd-lca-frame-brace-2003-2009-4runner

https://www.chaosfab.com/accessories/2003-2009-4Runner-Lower-Control-Arm-Cam-Tab-Gussets-59860

Anyone running the Taco Tabs here? They seem to be a great idea to keep caster/camber alignment in spec but I'm somewhat leery of running them with my non-adjustable JBA UCAs. Their "recommended" spec is the rear cam outboard and the front cam centered, which theoretically should max out caster and zero out camber but there doesn't seem to be much data on this and the only alignment sheet I've found saw the guy get +5.7 caster but with his camber still sitting round -1.5. SPC (or other) adjustable control arms) should be be to fix the camber here, but that won't be an option for me.

Plus, looking at my current alignment (which may have back knocked out of place from my last wheeling trip), the driver's side rear cam is outboard and the passenger side rear cam is onboard - seems strange. The front cam bolts appear straight but I'd have to take off the skid to get a better look. Here were my specs before all of that:

The other options are the Marlin LCA frame bracing/gusseting or TC's gusset tabs - for reference my tabs seem to be in tact so I'm leaning towards the Marlin kit.

 

[kasnerd]

neither...

https://jdfabrication.com/collections/05-15-6-lug/products/tacoma-05-18-lower-arm-pivots

 

[Drift Monkey]

neither...

https://jdfabrication.com/collections/05-15-6-lug/products/tacoma-05-18-lower-arm-pivots

Whoa, pretty awesome. But pricey...

 

[kasnerd]

Whoa, pretty awesome. But pricey...

even if you reinforce, with welding, you are several hundred dollars invested and still have a handful of issues. The geometry is incredibly important and that LCA checks off all those boxes. trust me I was where you are when the group buy happened. it's the only move, even if you don't go Long Travel or get their whole set-up. It sorts out TONS of Toyota headaches offroad.

 

[kasnerd]

it also has the skid and it tucks up higher than other aftermarket mass produced armor. I know, been there dumb that.

 

[Drift Monkey]

even if you reinforce, with welding, you are several hundred dollars invested and still have a handful of issues. The geometry is incredibly important and that LCA checks off all those boxes. trust me I was where you are when the group buy happened. it's the only move, even if you don't go Long Travel or get their whole set-up. It sorts out TONS of Toyota headaches offroad.

it also has the skid and it tucks up higher than other aftermarket mass produced armor. I know, been there dumb that.

Does this fit 4th gen 4Runners? I probably should have mentioned that in my OP.

 

[kasnerd]

Does this fit 4th gen 4Runners? I probably should have mentioned that in my OP.

negative, 4r guys might have some advice and pillow talk. @AssBurns @eimkeith <-- does slick fab kits to soothe your ills.

 

[Drift Monkey]

negative, 4r guys might have some advice and pillow talk. @AssBurns @eimkeith <-- does slick fab kits to soothe your ills.

Well I’m back to where I started then! I have Keith’s PCK and lower link mount reinforcements on order as it is, just trying to figure out what to do up front.

 

[Arcticelf]

Does this fit 4th gen 4Runners? I probably should have mentioned that in my OP.

Anything fits with enough welding.

Honestly it would probably be really easy to make these fit, the T4R arms are almost identical to the Taco, but use a wider bushing (longer bolt) on one of the mounts (I forget front or back) however the extra length is the "outside" of the LCA, so you could use the JDFab kit and just just one less spacer on the linger side of the arm.

The bolts are a different diameter too, but its easy enough to put in a taco spec white-line bushing or to get a different bold.

 

[AssBurns]

I’d first reach out to JD fab to see if there is any plans for them to produce a kit for 4th gens. Seems like it would be really easy for them to do since the front end is very similar.
Worst case is you can buy that Tacoma kit and get some OEM Tacoma LCA’s from someone that is going LT.

Otherwise I’d say the marlin kit looks pretty good. Are they even in production yet?

The poly kit seems pretty good too for the simplicity but the marlin kit addresses the week points in the bulkhead.

 

[kasnerd]

I’d first reach out to JD fab to see if there is any plans for them to produce a kit for 4th gens. Seems like it would be really easy for them to do since the front end is very similar.
Worst case is you can buy that Tacoma kit and get some OEM Tacoma LCA’s from someone that is going LT.

Otherwise I’d say the marlin kit looks pretty good. Are they even in production yet?

The poly kit seems pretty good too for the simplicity but the marlin kit addresses the week points in the bulkhead.

@Drift Monkey *cough* I'll have OEM LCAs (85k no abuse) available after JD does their thing. They'll need a home, not gonna sit on them.

 

[4runner DOA]

I’d first reach out to JD fab to see if there is any plans for them to produce a kit for 4th gens. Seems like it would be really easy for them to do since the front end is very similar.
Worst case is you can buy that Tacoma kit and get some OEM Tacoma LCA’s from someone that is going LT.

Otherwise I’d say the marlin kit looks pretty good. Are they even in production yet?

The poly kit seems pretty good too for the simplicity but the marlin kit addresses the week points in the bulkhead.

They are, but they haven't gotten there yet. I actually reached to them awhile back to be a guinea pig and I was supposed to call, but I've been so busy with work I pushed it off.

 

[kasnerd]

They are, but they haven't gotten there yet. I actually reached to them awhile back to be a guinea pig and I was supposed to call, but I've been so busy with work I pushed it off.

what's stronger with most of us? laziness or resistance to peer pressure? it's quite the dynamic

 

[4runner DOA]

what's stronger with most of us? laziness or resistance to peer pressure? it's quite the dynamic

Lazy and busy. It's not something I *need* so it's not high on the priority list.

 

[Drift Monkey]

Otherwise I’d say the marlin kit looks pretty good. Are they even in production yet?

The poly kit seems pretty good too for the simplicity but the marlin kit addresses the week points in the bulkhead.

Yeah, I have a buddy that's done both, seems like overkill. The taco tabs seem like what I'm after, but I'm a bit leery of getting stuck with an alignment that is off in some form or fashion. Because that's...just what happens to me.

 

[kasnerd]

Yeah, I have a buddy that's done both, seems like overkill. The taco tabs seem like what I'm after, but I'm a bit leery of getting stuck with an alignment that is off in some form or fashion. Because that's...just what happens to me.

call JD... maybe you and @4runner DOA can test bed.

 

[Drift Monkey]

Yeah, I have a buddy that's done both, seems like overkill. The taco tabs seem like what I'm after, but I'm a bit leery of getting stuck with an alignment that is off in some form or fashion. Because that's...just what happens to me.

So update - I went with the Taco Tabs and they've been fine but as expected my alignment is a bit off. I do, however, clear 35s fine...so that's a plus.

The issue seems to stem from the driver's side alignment - I have positive caster and a low SAI on the driver's side according to the print out - which is strange since the settings are identical on both sides (Rear LCA tabs set outboard, front tabs inboard, SPC UCAs set at setting G with camber adjusted on max negative) - the passenger side is perfect.

This seems to indicate that either my driver's side LCA is bent or the LCA frame mounts are bent. I replaced LCAs last March-ish with cheapie 1A Auto LCAs (classic seized cam bolts) - so perhaps it's a manufacturing defect? I"m getting some SuperPro double offset LCAs to try out, and if that isn't the issue - I guess I'll really need to revisit the JDFab. It'd be nice to get some caster back too - but she honesty doesn't drive terrible as is right now.

 

[4runner DOA]

So update - I went with the Taco Tabs and they've been fine but as expected my alignment is a bit off. I do, however, clear 35s fine...so that's a plus.

The issue seems to stem from the driver's side alignment - I have positive caster and a low SAI on the driver's side according to the print out - which is strange since the settings are identical on both sides (Rear LCA tabs set outboard, front tabs inboard, SPC UCAs set at setting G with camber adjusted on max negative) - the passenger side is perfect.

This seems to indicate that either my driver's side LCA is bent or the LCA frame mounts are bent. I replaced LCAs last March-ish with cheapie 1A Auto LCAs (classic seized cam bolts) - so perhaps it's a manufacturing defect? I"m getting some SuperPro double offset LCAs to try out, and if that isn't the issue - I guess I'll really need to revisit the JDFab. It'd be nice to get some caster back too - but she honesty doesn't drive terrible as is right now.

Could be a number of things but those alignment specs look like total shit to begin with. That tech was lazy, he didn't even try. I usually get 3ish caster and close to 0 camber from my usual place. He's not even within spec for caster.

 

[Drift Monkey]

Could be a number of things but those alignment specs look like total shit to begin with. That tech was lazy, he didn't even try. I usually get 3ish caster and close to 0 camber from my usual place. He's not even within spec for caster.

The caster is my fault - setting G pushes the wheels forward in the wheelwell to clear 35s without chopping. The caster isn't what I'm worried about here though - that I can live with - it drives fine, just a bit loose as you can imagine - good for trails, not as fun on the highway.

 

[4runner DOA]

The caster is my fault - setting G pushes the wheels forward in the wheelwell to clear 35s without chopping. The caster isn't what I'm worried about here though - that I can live with - it drives fine, just a bit loose as you can imagine - good for trails, not as fun on the highway.

Okay wait. I had to go back and look. You're running locked cam tabs with no adjustable UCA? You'll never get into spec for camber. It's not just a set it and forget it. You still have tie rods, ball joints, worn uca/lca bushings. Any number of things that could prevent camber being in spec with locked caster. You have to have some adjustability to make locked cam tabs align correct.